TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2021-22 (#1)

[S87]

I think they don't really here at all and I certainly didn't send e-mails with the goal of it helping me out! The US is keen on a lot of strange formalities and since careers advisers always said to write thank you e-mails (they are actually a lot more old-school than the UK in many ways) I got into the habit when I was there.

I just do it as a matter of practice and often I get no response, sometimes I get a one-line response and sometimes I get an e-mail that is just lovely and makes me really glad that I reached out! I can say that I never regretted sending a thank you e-mail and it only takes like 5 minutes

I actually have an interview with an American company on Monday and currently drafting my interview answers. I think am going to use your approach.

 

[James Carrabino]

I actually have an interview with an American company on Monday and currently drafting my interview answers. I think am going to use your approach.

Again I do sense that it's not a culture here so I certainly would not feel any pressure to do so! But as you said in your previous post, being polite can never hurt

 

[Adrian_S]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

 

[GXA123]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm? For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply that I should use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or maybe some combination of both of these).

combination, hope your VIs of go well <3

 

[Adrian_S]

combination, hope your VIs of go well <3

Thank you, you absolute angel!

 

[thirdtimelucky]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm? For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply that I should use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or maybe some combination of both of these).

I think its always good to incorporate new experiences if you have them and develop/edit your applications but in my case I've had success at the same firm by only slightly editing my applications. I would say, however, that it helps to try and evaluate what you think went wrong with your applications this year and explore your interest in law if you can just so your answers are the best they can be

 

[James Carrabino]

I think they don't really here at all and I certainly didn't send e-mails with the goal of it helping me out! The US is keen on a lot of strange formalities and since careers advisers always said to write thank you e-mails (they are actually a lot more old-school than the UK in many ways) I got into the habit when I was there.

I just do it as a matter of practice and often I get no response, sometimes I get a one-line response and sometimes I get an e-mail that is just lovely and makes me really glad that I reached out! I can say that I never regretted sending a thank you e-mail and it only takes like 5 minutes

The law firm recruitment process in the US probably wouldn't go down super well here either:

First-stage interviews take place on campus at the different law schools and each firm will have a designated campus interviewer for each law school who will often be an alum of that law school currently working at the firm. To get a first-stage interview, you are only competing against other candidates from your law school and each law school will essentially have a designated number of places available at each firm. The campus interviewers then report back to graduate recruitment who arrange the final-stage interviews at the office.

Inevitably not every law school ends up getting included here. If you do not go to a T14 law school you may not have a recruiter from every firm assigned to your law school which would mean that you have to apply to the general applicant pool, where you have a far lower chance of getting an interview (almost all recruitment tends to be done on campus). In fact, the top law schools guarantee students at least one first-stage interview at the firm of their choice!

 

[S87]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

 

[James Carrabino]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

I see no reason why the core motivation of your application should change at all. I would not copy your answer word for word and I would certainly add any updated details that continue to inform your motivations, but on the whole these answers should not need to change too much. The answers that I would change are those about 'Recent examples of a time when...' or those about recent commercial news stories!

 

[James Carrabino]

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

I see no reason why the core motivation of your application should change at all. I would not copy your answer word for word and I would certainly add any updated details that continue to inform your motivations, but on the whole these answers should not need to change too much. The answers that I would change are those about 'Recent examples of a time when...' or those about recent commercial news stories!

Yes @S87 this is a good point - I would certainly search inside myself to see if there are better answers! But I was assuming that if your apps got you to the VI then they may have been good enough so it is more the VIs that need working on (although you may yet succeed, fingers crossed)!

 

[Adrian_S]

Can I be a bit brutal?

I would say both but also think why did I not succeed? Maybe those examples are good, but they might also not be good and you need to introduce new ones. If a product does not win then better change it! I am sorry but this is the approach that I would use for myself too.

Definitely! Thinking back about past application mistakes is a really important part of improving for the future.

I should have been more clear. I was mostly interested in cases where I've passed the initial written application stage and need to submit another application in a future cycle because, say, my VIs weren't as strong the first time around (and in my case, I'll defo need to practice VIs).

 

[James Carrabino]

Thanks so much!! This firm only hires through direct TC soooo not sure if that means they want everything sorted in Feb time

In my view, you should at least do the interview and then worry about it later

 

[Jessica Booker]

After an AC, is it common practice to send an email to the interviewers thanking them for their time?

If you have their email, then fine. If you haven’t and you track it down (and it isn’t really easy to find on the firms website) then I wouldn’t.

 

[James Carrabino]

I got given 7 days to do an online assessment and have been working through it slowly until today, the 7th day, where it abruptly expired at a random time and now my assessment got sent off only partly completed - i emailed gradrec asking because they never specified a time the url would expire and i assumed it was until the end of the day (they havent replied yet) but any thoughts?

Could it be 7 days from the exact time you first started it? I have had assessments follow a timeline like this; best to see what grad rec says!

 

[AvniD]

After an AC, is it common practice to send an email to the interviewers thanking them for their time?

I would always do this, regardless of whether it's part of UK/US culture or if it makes an impact on their decision.

It's courteous and helps cement you in the memory of your interviewers who you many work alongside down the line in the future, even if you don't end up securing a TC/VS.

In my emails, I would begin by thanking them for their time and move on to briefly speaking about a conversation that stood out to me in the interview. I would always keep the emails polite and would be careful to not sound too eager. I hope this helps if you consider sending them!

 

[AvniD]

I'll be sending TCLA moderators thank you notes and taco bell when I get my training contract - for putting up with all my application psychodrama on this forum.

This made my day 😂😂😂

 

[starbright]

Hi @corinium!

Huge congratulations on being invited to your first AC. I am really chuffed for you. It is a very surreal feeling and you have done extremely well to get so far in the process.

In line with @S87's insight above, I would really recommend Watson's Daily for brushing up on commercial awareness. The forum's commercial awareness updates are also fantastic (I wish I had used them when I applied!). If you can, start now and try to work on this little and often if you can (commercial awareness is very difficult to cram). You have plenty of time to do this, so just get stuck in as early as you can.

For a general breakdown of AC preparation, this post is a breakdown how I approached AC preparation. Please do not take it as a perfect approach, but it really is the one I employed!



Hey @robynm09,

I am so sorry about my error in my previous post. I have now amended the original post with the correct link. For ease though, this is the page I was talking about regarding article interviews!

Please do let me know how it goes



Hi @starbright,

So I do not think that it makes a difference either way honestly. I personally always did this. I know Partners interview lots of people and may not even read it. However, on the off chance they do, I always wanted to say thank you for the opportunity. I know opinion on this is divided though! I wouldn't overthink it though.

I hope that helps 🚀



Hey @gracelaw_,

My advice would be to make the most of the opportunity. You can never interview too many times for one. And as another user pointed out, if you did get offered a TC, you could ask for an extension.

It is a huge achievement to have been progressed so far with two firms too! Great going Grace!



Hey @lawvc2021,

I know others have responded to you on this, but I really recognise this feeling and empathise. I always suffered from self-doubt following my ACs/interviews. All I would say is that it is extremely difficult to objectively evaluate how you did in an AC. As best you can, try not to predict the outcome of your AC. So long as you did your best, you really cannot do any more.

It goes without saying, my fingers are crossed for you! 🤞



Alright alright @James Carrabino enough with the roasting 🍗.

The post is now amended.

I hope @robynm09 has recovered from their disappointment on discovering the error too. 😅

I always did - maybe this is a US thing but all my friends who did consulting recruitment in the US were told that interviewers looked to see if they received a thank you e-mail and that it could make the difference between two very equal candidates. That said, I do get the sense that it is not such an important thing in London TC/VS recruitment.

Regardless, I always believed that it was a polite gesture to send a kind note thanking the interviewer for their time. I also do this whenever anyone has a call with me or helps me out with something - it is good practice throughout one's career to recognise when others have invested their time on your behalf and thank them for it. I often received some really lovely responses (some even telling me how well they thought my interview went which I feel like they were not supposed to reveal)!

If you have their email, then fine. If you haven’t and you track it down (and it isn’t really easy to find on the firms website) then I wouldn’t.

I would always do this, regardless of whether it's part of UK/US culture or if it makes an impact on their decision.

It's courteous and helps cement you in the memory of your interviewers who you many work alongside down the line in the future, even if you don't end up securing a TC/VS.

In my emails, I would begin by thanking them for their time and move on to briefly speaking about a conversation that stood out to me in the interview. I would always keep the emails polite and would be careful to not sound too eager. I hope this helps if you consider sending them!

Hi all, thanks so much for replying!

My only concern about sending the thank you email was that I would come across as trying too hard or being desperate. And as @Jessica Booker said, I don't actually have my interviewer's emails and so I'd have to stalk them to find it! 🤣

Thank you once again though!!

 

[AvniD]

I'm curious.

Assuming I need to re-apply for VS/TCs (a very plausible assumption given that I've bombed the only two VIs I've received), how bad does it look if I make points that are similar to those I made in a previous written application to the same firm?

For instance, do I need to have entirely different rationales for 'why law' or 'why this firm'? Or is it simply enough that I use more recent/different evidence to substantiate the same points that I made in a previous application? (Or perhaps some combination of both of these).

If you say your core motivation for applying to the firm is their culture, and you want to re-use this then try to deepen your knowledge of the firm's culture (speak to their trainees, read more news articles about them, understand their objective behind their cultural initiatives etc.) so that the evidence that you use to back up your motivation is heftier than the ones you chose to rely on in the previous cycle.

There is always a way to rephrase something or demonstrate deeper, more developed motivations. It's tough, requires a ton of introspection, research and reflection on your life experiences and career ambitions, but once you do it, you will find that your application will have improved tremendously.

 

[AvniD]

Hi all, thanks so much for replying!

My only concern about sending the thank you email was that I would come across as trying too hard or being desperate. And as @Jessica Booker said, I don't actually have my interviewer's emails and so I'd have to stalk them to find it! 🤣

Thank you once again though!!

The emails are generally listed on the interviewers' firm profiles. If they aren't, you can email grad rec explaining that you would like to thank your interviewers and if they could kindly share the relevant email addresses.

Wishing you the best 😇

 

[James Carrabino]

How do people improve on timed VIs? I did a video interview simulation with TCLA and got decent feedback but my brain just absolutely melted during the real thing. Also I hate looking at myself on camera - so cringe.

It's tough... the cringest thing is seeing yourself not as you would in a mirror but the way the camera sees you, and like if you lean your head one way then it leans the other way on the screen 🤣 I think the trick is to really relax and know that it will seem cringe. The video interviews where I was successful were honestly some of the ones where I was more relaxed and had some 'ums' and some 'ers' as opposed to those where I was almost over-prepared and probably came across as somewhat robotic!