TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2024-25

[jacksollaf]

Inspired by the great Tintin to give an update! Basically, I posted the list below (the post I replied to) on Monday; since then, I have received a PFO from TLT, NRF (post-vi), BCLP (post-vi), and Morgan Lewis (post-ti)... Therefore, 65 applications, 48 rejections, 1 offer, and 16 pending (8 realistically speaking):

Firms I am assuming PFOs for because people have progressed [some even received offers]: Morrison Foerster, Shoosmiths, DACB [horrible percentile in critical thinking feedback], RPC [73% though on WG], Latham & Watkins [still alive?], Linklaters [low percentile in WG], Orrick [didn't receive the WG], Paynes Hicks Beach [honestly don't even remember why I applied to this to begin with ]

Basically, the only firms pending thus far with a realistic potential are the following:

1.Greenberg Traurig (TC)
2. Howes Spercival
3. Withers (TC)
4. Simmons and Simmons
5. Ropes & Gray
6. UN Legal Affairs Intern
7. Katten
8. King & Spalding

An update on my unsuccessfully successful application cycle; 65 applications, 44 rejections so far, 1 offer, and 20 still pending (including awaiting 3 interview outcomes)...

HFW (offer )
Gibson Dunn post-vi
Baker McKenzie
Allen & Shearman |
Goodwin
Pinsent Masons |
Mayer Brown |
Skadden
Morrison Foerster
Slaughter & May |
Jones Day |
Cooley
Linklaters
Willkie Farr & Gallagher |
Latham & Watkins
Forsters LLP
TLT
Dechert LLP
Orrick
BCLP (awaiting interview outcome)
Paynes Hicks Beach
Eversheds
Clyde & Co
Addleshaw Goddard LLP
Kirkland
Covington LLP
White & Case
Macfarlanes
UN Legal Affairs Intern
Clifford Chance Dubai |
Weil |
Katten
Charles Russel Speechlys
King & Spalding (TC)
Quinn Emmanuel (Paris)
Sullivan & Cromwell LLP
Legal intern at random company in Scotland (ghosted so probably not)
Deloitte
Vison & Elkins
Morgan Lewis (awaiting interview outcome)
Walker Morris
CMS
Hogan Lovells
Osborne Clarke
Davis Polk
RPC
Ropes & Gray
Paul Weiss
Squire Patton Boggs
Mills & Reeve
Simmons & Simmons
Norton Rose Fulbright (awaiting interview outcome)
Withers (TC)
Joelson
Capsticks LLP |
Gowling WLG
Gide Loyrette Nouel London (ghosted)
DAC Beachcroft (TC)
Howes Spercival
PwC |
Cleary Gottlieb |
Reed Smith |
Farrer & Co
Shoosmiths
Freshfields
Debevoise & Plimpton
Greenberg Traurig (TC)
Lockton
Watson Farley & Williams
HSF


Basically, still waiting to hear back from the following firms, out of my 65 applications :

1. Morrison Foerster
2.Greenberg Traurig (TC)
3. Shoosmiths
4. Howes Spercival
5. DAC Beachcroft (TC)
6. Withers (TC)
7. Norton Rose Fulbright (awaiting interview outcome)
8. Simmons and Simmons
9. Ropes & Gray
10. RPC
11. Morgan Lewis (awaiting interview outcome)
12. UN Legal Affairs Intern
13. Paynes Hicks Beach
14. BCLP (awaiting interview outcome)
15. Orrick
16. TLT
17. Latham & Watkins
18. Linklaters
19. Katten
20. King & Spalding

 

[jacksollaf]

@Jessica Booker @Andrei Radu (and anyone please chime in if you can help, even if its only relating to a part of my question!!!!)

I apologize in advance for the long message. I just feel very lost and disheartened at the moment.

I just got rejected following my only AC, and I really dont know what to do anymore. It was my only AC and I'm unsure at all how to move forward , especially as I'm an international student, meaning I wont be able to stay in the UK after I graduate next year, if I dont have anything secured, also due to cost issues.

Would you please be able to give me some advice moving forward? I have a great deal of anxiety that I might not even get to an AC next year, and that this year's was only because 1. I had a mentoring scheme relating to the firm and 2. I had mitigating circumstances for my poor first year grades.

I do not have any open days/ mentoring schemes relating to any other firms, so I'm worried that just like this year, I wont get any ACs for those firms next year either, and the only firm for which I had a lot to speak about, is the one that reject me after the AC. It was also one of the few (non US) firms that didn't use a video interview or the SJT, and I'm notoriously bad at those.

I am also worried that if I fall back on my second year grades, it will make it even more challenging for me to acquire one.

Besides these concerns, I have a few specific questions:

Would u please tell me whether I can apply next year to the same firm, which is Freshfields,given I was rejected at AC stage, and if I do, will I be given any sort of exception to the Watson Glaser test?

I also want to ask whether I can continue using my same personal statement given it allowed me to pass the application stage, and if not, how must I show changes? can I still retain some parts of it?

Am I allowed to apply to the winter vacation scheme? every firm I applied to was for the 2025 summer vacation scheme, and I want to know whether the 2025 winter vacation scheme counts as something in the next cycle? I'm particularly worried because some firms only allow second year students for summer vac schemes.

What can I do to improve my applications next year, and show progress?

Would it be recommended for me to apply to direct TCs next year, or should I stick to vac schemes?

Are there any alternative options I should keep open right now, in the event that I dont manage to secure a 2028 one? I'm thinking along the lines of masters or other legal jobs, like teaching, but I'm not sure how feasible this is? is there anything else I could be looking at?

and just one more thing, would it be silly to maybe respond to the rejection email requesting to be reconsidered for this cycle in case of any drop outs or changes?

I know this is a lot of questions, and I apologise again. As an international student who is under a sort of time pressure , ive been feeling really anxious and like I blew my only chance. Any advice would be appreciated, and I hope this is useful for anyone else in a similar situation!!

Don't feel disheartened! It's a really though process and acceptance rate at almost every single firm is at 1-3% so it's extremely competitive... It isn't about you specifically, it's just that at the end of the day, we are say 2000 to apply to one firm and they only have 15 spots, even if you made it to the top 16, you wouldn't get a place, so it all goes down to luck sadly... At the end of the day, you only need one firm...

I don't have the answers to all of your questions, but what I do know is that, at least that's what I would do if I don't manage to secure anything, you could apply to University of Law (or BP university) and study their LLM in SQE 1 & 2, and subsequently pass the SQE in order to at least secure that... Now of course, having a training contract would be a lot more advantageous as they would fund your studies, but if you are financially able to, I think me personally that's what I am going to do... Because technically if you apply for a graduate visa (which is two years), it's going to run from the time you graduate from your LLB technically... So if you graduate in 2026, you'll have until 2028 to secure something... On the other hand, if you do the LLM, you 1) would've passed the SQE and 2) can apply at the end of your LLM for the Graduate Visa, so basically until 2029... (BTW SOMEONE CORRECT ME IF I AM MISTAKEN IN THAT REGARD PLEASE, BECAUSE IDK IF IM 100% CORRECT)And then in the meantime, while passing the SQE and LLM, try to apply and also try to refine your applications further! PM me if you want, as I found a technique that really worked for me later on (which I wish I knew sooner and which helped me secure a VS at HFW this summer)...

Again, don't be disheartened, it's really though and really really competitive, so it isn't specifically you! Also, depending on where you are originally from or where you live, perhaps you may also try to apply for some sort of legal experience (depends on where that is though because getting something in Dubai is a lot easier than getting something if you live in Germany or France for instance...)

PM me if you want!

EDIT: also, me personally I would recommend applying to VS instead of DTC unless you really have a lot of legal experience (advice given to me from a 2nd year trainee); unless the firm specifically says that you wouldn't be eligible to apply..

PS. I am re-reading this and realising that it doesn't necessarily make so much sense, so apologies

 

[radssss]

The thing is they said Wed 28th Feb so is it acc Wed or Friday…

Oh shit, I just realised that (now my anxiety has increased)

 

[GUt02]

Holding myself accountable (Morgan Lewis rejection)

CC*
HSF
NRF
Weil
Akin
Sidley
Orrick
Willkie
Cooley
Latham
Milbank
Kirkland
Dechert
Skadden
Goodwin
Covington
Linklaters*
Paul, Weiss
Slaughters*
Freshfields*
Fried Frank*
Gibson Dunn
Macfarlanes*
White & Case
Morgan Lewis
Paul Hastings*
Hogan Lovells*
Cleary Gottlieb
A&O Shearman
Vinson & Elkins
Arnold & Porter
Baker McKenzie
King & Spalding*
Winston & Strawn
Morrison Foerster
Sullivan & Cromwell

Key: = application submitted; = test received; = telephone interview; = video interview; = rejection.

This rejection was honestly pretty tough. I felt the TI went well. I guess that wasn't the case.

Do you mind me asking when Linklaters got back to you?

 

[abbietc03]

Would 20/36 for an SJT be an automatic PFO?

Hi! I got 20/36 on an SJT for Paul, Weiss and I got invited to interview. I guess it depends on how much importance the firm places on the test, but I don’t think it is an automatic PFO.

 

[desperateTCseeker1998]

Holding myself accountable (Morgan Lewis rejection)

CC*
HSF
NRF
Weil
Akin
Sidley
Orrick
Willkie
Cooley
Latham
Milbank
Kirkland
Dechert
Skadden
Goodwin
Covington
Linklaters*
Paul, Weiss
Slaughters*
Freshfields*
Fried Frank*
Gibson Dunn
Macfarlanes*
White & Case
Morgan Lewis
Paul Hastings*
Hogan Lovells*
Cleary Gottlieb
A&O Shearman
Vinson & Elkins
Arnold & Porter
Baker McKenzie
King & Spalding*
Winston & Strawn
Morrison Foerster
Sullivan & Cromwell

Key: = application submitted; = test received; = telephone interview; = video interview; = rejection.

This rejection was honestly pretty tough. I felt the TI went well. I guess that wasn't the case.

I also felt I did well at the TI so feel you - would’ve been interesting to get feedback on it but they don’t offer it which I think is so poor.

 

[Bread]

Is anyone else quite worried about what the US DEI situation means for firms which rely heavily on the pre-recorded video interview assessments/short video interviews? It basically has you recording 6-8 minutes of yourself, answering very general questions with no follow-ups. Obviously, structure and content is key, but clearly 6-8 minutes isn't enough to fully assess a candidate, get to know them as a person, understand their thinking etc. It can show some things conclusively though, and that's the candidate's race, their accent, their gender, their sexual orientation or trans identity if they clearly display this through their communication or appearance... Basically, while ACs also clearly also reveal these attributes, candidates also have hours and hours to show other attributes and show your personality, and how their background has shaped their thinking in a unique and valuable way. I'm worried that video interviews will provide very limited opportunity for firms to evaluate a candidate's potential to succeed as a trainee, and everything needed to box them into stereotypes. Open for discussion

Not sure how the US D.E.I. situation affects that, the issues you’re mentioning about VIs exist regardless of that

 

[Tintin06]

Do you mind me asking when Linklaters got back to you?

I'm afraid I don't remember it.

 

[eleven14og]

@Jessica Booker @Andrei Radu (and anyone please chime in if you can help, even if its only relating to a part of my question!!!!)

I apologize in advance for the long message. I just feel very lost and disheartened at the moment.

I just got rejected following my only AC, and I really dont know what to do anymore. It was my only AC and I'm unsure at all how to move forward , especially as I'm an international student, meaning I wont be able to stay in the UK after I graduate next year, if I dont have anything secured, also due to cost issues.

Would you please be able to give me some advice moving forward? I have a great deal of anxiety that I might not even get to an AC next year, and that this year's was only because 1. I had a mentoring scheme relating to the firm and 2. I had mitigating circumstances for my poor first year grades.

I do not have any open days/ mentoring schemes relating to any other firms, so I'm worried that just like this year, I wont get any ACs for those firms next year either, and the only firm for which I had a lot to speak about, is the one that reject me after the AC. It was also one of the few (non US) firms that didn't use a video interview or the SJT, and I'm notoriously bad at those.

I am also worried that if I fall back on my second year grades, it will make it even more challenging for me to acquire one.

Besides these concerns, I have a few specific questions:

Would u please tell me whether I can apply next year to the same firm, which is Freshfields,given I was rejected at AC stage, and if I do, will I be given any sort of exception to the Watson Glaser test?

I also want to ask whether I can continue using my same personal statement given it allowed me to pass the application stage, and if not, how must I show changes? can I still retain some parts of it?

Am I allowed to apply to the winter vacation scheme? every firm I applied to was for the 2025 summer vacation scheme, and I want to know whether the 2025 winter vacation scheme counts as something in the next cycle? I'm particularly worried because some firms only allow second year students for summer vac schemes.

What can I do to improve my applications next year, and show progress?

Would it be recommended for me to apply to direct TCs next year, or should I stick to vac schemes?

Are there any alternative options I should keep open right now, in the event that I dont manage to secure a 2028 one? I'm thinking along the lines of masters or other legal jobs, like teaching, but I'm not sure how feasible this is? is there anything else I could be looking at?

and just one more thing, would it be silly to maybe respond to the rejection email requesting to be reconsidered for this cycle in case of any drop outs or changes?

I know this is a lot of questions, and I apologise again. As an international student who is under a sort of time pressure , ive been feeling really anxious and like I blew my only chance. Any advice would be appreciated, and I hope this is useful for anyone else in a similar situation!!

Don't feel disheartened! It's a really though process and acceptance rate at almost every single firm is at 1-3% so it's extremely competitive... It isn't about you specifically, it's just that at the end of the day, we are say 2000 to apply to one firm and they only have 15 spots, even if you made it to the top 16, you wouldn't get a place, so it all goes down to luck sadly... At the end of the day, you only need one firm...

I don't have the answers to all of your questions, but what I do know is that, at least that's what I would do if I don't manage to secure anything, you could apply to University of Law (or BP university) and study their LLM in SQE 1 & 2, and subsequently pass the SQE in order to at least secure that... Now of course, having a training contract would be a lot more advantageous as they would fund your studies, but if you are financially able to, I think me personally that's what I am going to do... Because technically if you apply for a graduate visa (which is two years), it's going to run from the time you graduate from your LLB technically... So if you graduate in 2026, you'll have until 2028 to secure something... On the other hand, if you do the LLM, you 1) would've passed the SQE and 2) can apply at the end of your LLM for the Graduate Visa, so basically until 2029... (BTW SOMEONE CORRECT ME IF I AM MISTAKEN IN THAT REGARD PLEASE, BECAUSE IDK IF IM 100% CORRECT)And then in the meantime, while passing the SQE and LLM, try to apply and also try to refine your applications further! PM me if you want, as I found a technique that really worked for me later on (which I wish I knew sooner and which helped me secure a VS at HFW this summer)...

Again, don't be disheartened, it's really though and really really competitive, so it isn't specifically you! Also, depending on where you are originally from or where you live, perhaps you may also try to apply for some sort of legal experience (depends on where that is though because getting something in Dubai is a lot easier than getting something if you live in Germany or France for instance...)

PM me if you want!

EDIT: also, me personally I would recommend applying to VS instead of DTC unless you really have a lot of legal experience (advice given to me from a 2nd year trainee); unless the firm specifically says that wouldn't be eligible to apply..

Adding to @jacksollaf 's point on graduate visa, you can only use it once so i would suggest either (1) do graduate visa and try to gain more experience during the two years, and hopefully secure a TC before it expires, if not you can do SQE LLM then; or (2) do SQE LLM after undergrad, then apply for graduate visa. But that won't necessarily happen as you will definitely get better next cycle! It's already a massive achievement getting to AC during your second year so don't feel disheartened!

Of the two options, I did (1) because I don't want to self fund SQE and gain some paralegal experience. But it is slightly riskier because a lot of paralegal roles require SQE 1(LPC back when I graduated). So it may take longer than expected to get a job. But I think for VS/TC apps work experiences are more valuable in comparison to passing the SQE. It can also give you more edge for DTC apps.

Feel free to PM me as well re graduate visa or securing paralegal roles!

 

[vr36]

Does White & Case still have AC's scheduled for next week? Trying to ascertain when we can expect a decision for Summer.

 

[Tintin06]

I also felt I did well at the TI so feel you - would’ve been interesting to get feedback on it but they don’t offer it which I think is so poor.

I agree with this quite strongly. They did not run many interviews. Other firms like that provide feedback. E.g. Wilkie and White & Case. It's really not great at all.

 

[futuretrainee!]

Well yes, but also companies and firms around the world are changing their mentality on hiring candidates from diverse backgrounds. Essentially the VI format becomes more dangerous with no voice at the back of a recruiter's head underlining these considerations

DEI in the US was extremely toxic as it was affirmative action where diversity was exercised through quotas and preferential hiring for underrepresented groups - this is counter to any business, profit-making mandate as hiring should be based on merits. DEI in the UK is far more digestible where under-represented backgrounds are considered proportionally which helps contextualise an applicant but still very much focuses on the merits of a candidate's application. If there is a "voice at the back of a recruiter's head" to hire a particular candidate of a race to represent a particular community, I think we have gone astray from what DEI was meant to do, which is level the ground instead of offering a leg-up.

 

[baj5]

WBD test feedback is brutal. Grit 6, applied intellect 4, creative force 4, digital mindset 6

 

[Harvey Specter - Presiding Partner]

Is anyone else quite worried about what the US DEI situation means for firms which rely heavily on the pre-recorded video interview assessments/short video interviews? It basically has you recording 6-8 minutes of yourself, answering very general questions with no follow-ups. Obviously, structure and content is key, but clearly 6-8 minutes isn't enough to fully assess a candidate, get to know them as a person, understand their thinking etc. It can show some things conclusively though, and that's the candidate's race, their accent, their gender, their sexual orientation or trans identity if they clearly display this through their communication or appearance... Basically, while ACs also clearly also reveal these attributes, candidates also have hours and hours to show other attributes and show their personalities, and how their background has shaped their thinking in a unique and valuable way. I'm worried that video interviews will provide very limited opportunity for firms to evaluate a candidate's potential to succeed as a trainee, and everything needed to box them into stereotypes. Open for discussion

This is something that has been on my mind for some time going through this application cycle. I have a strong interest in US firms, but they rely heavily on VI. I am worried about the impact of the DEI situation in the US and if it will mean US firms change their policies around DEI in their UK offices’ graduate recruitment processes.

While it is possible that a PFO post-VI is down to things like poor structure, waffling, lack of key content, etc. it can also be down to bias and prejudice. While this problem has existed even before the DEI situation in the US, I think it’ll get worse now. No firm can ever guarantee that there is 0% bias in their processes. That’s why even now some US firms’ future trainees all come from quite similar backgrounds.

So far in my own experience with Willkie, I have not been made to feel this way (yet). Credit has to be given to Gemma for ensuring their process is as fair and transparent as possible (two of their recruitment stages are entirely CV blind) which I think more firms should adopt. If I were to do a 2nd cycle and apply to other US firms, I’m not sure if the same could be said. I think in the UK there is more of an issue with elitism and classism, in the context of city law firms’ recruitment. For those who come from ethnic minority backgrounds and lower socio-economic backgrounds, I think it’s a double edged sword.​

 

[Someoneinlaw]

HSF AC invite (applied 27th of November ) . I honestly thought Macfarlanes will be my only AC this cycle but look at God
Also , if you’re still waiting to hear back from them , don’t loose hope. I read that someone received SVS offer on this platform and was sort of expecting a PFO but it looks like they are very much still sending out invites so hang on!
Ps: I will very much appreciate any insights from anyone who has done HSF AC!

 

[Ricky]

has anybody done the V&E interview this week? Heard from a friend they are ongoing.

Three weeks of interviews - outcomes mid-March.

 

[Legal Wizard]

Fairly sure, all Weil ACs have concluded now, anyone know when Weil will communicate results?

Next week

 

[Harvey Specter - Presiding Partner]

Surely you want to be selected for a job based on your ability, rather than because you tick certain boxes?

I think the OP’s point (which I agree with) was that someone can possess the ability, but because they tick those boxes (which become visible to recruiters through things like a VI), there is room for bias and prejudice. Of course I would want to be hired based on my ability, but it’s inevitable that someone (e.g., grad rec, associates, partners, etc.) might not believe I possess the ability because of my background (bias and prejudice). With the DEI situation in the US, this could only get worse, especially in relation to US law firms.​

 

[billyonthespeeddial]

Sorry, I had actually deleted my initial posts because I didn't want to start a thing, but I guess it's too late now haha. Just want to clarify that what I meant was NOT about being picked to fill a diversity quota. It was about knowing that people would take a moment to acknowledge whether they were being prejudiced against some traits which may in fact not be indicative of potential or ability. i.e. it was simply about not being discriminated against.

 

[Interested_In_Law]

This is something that has been on my mind for some time going through this application cycle. I have a strong interest in US firms, but they rely heavily on VI. I am worried about the impact of the DEI situation in the US and if it will mean US firms change their policies around DEI in their UK offices’ graduate recruitment processes.

While it is possible that a PFO post-VI is down to things like poor structure, waffling, lack of key content, etc. it can also be down to bias and prejudice. While this problem has existed even before the DEI situation in the US, I think it’ll get worse now. No firm can ever guarantee that there is 0% bias in their processes. That’s why even now some US firms’ future trainees all come from quite similar backgrounds.

So far in my own experience with Willkie, I have not been made to feel this way (yet). Credit has to be given to Gemma for ensuring their process is as fair and transparent as possible (two of their recruitment stages are entirely CV blind) which I think more firms should adopt. If I were to do a 2nd cycle and apply to other US firms, I’m not sure if the same could be said. I think in the UK there is more of an issue with elitism and classism, in the context of city law firms’ recruitment. For those who come from ethnic minority backgrounds and lower socio-economic backgrounds, I think it’s a double edged sword.​

Interestingly, the video interview platform HireVue, which a number of law firms use, has come under fire for using facial recognition data in AI technology to assess candidates in a way which could potentially be discriminatory. I think it is quite worrying, because AI technology does have a tendency to reinforce built-in biases.

Class Action Targeting Video Interview Technology Reminds Employers of Testing Risks | Paul Hastings LLP

www.paulhastings.com