TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2021-22 (#1)

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George Maxwell

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Hi George thank you for the offer! Are you able to say how you would approach the general question of being asked 'why do you want to work for a US firm'?
Hi @letmeintolaw,

Thank you for the question! I am delighted to help. Always feel free to follow up if anything is unclear.

So before you embark on your answer, consider the following:
  • The firm. US firms in London are not an homogenous group. For example, White & Case has 89 trainees in total, whereas Orrick has only 14 (and firms like Akin Gump has 13) (all according to Chambers Student). This is important because the size of trainee cohort will impact your experience as a junior lawyer. Generally speaking though, US firms have fewer trainees than UK firms. US firms in London also specialise in different things, although of course they will have multiple strengths. White & Case is very strong in EIPAF (Energy, Infrastructure, Project and Asset Finance) whereas Akin is known for financial restructuring/insolvency work.
  • Your priorities. What sort of work do you want to do? How do you work? What sort of career would you like to pursue? What sort of training would you like?
Generally speaking, US firms employ leaner teams (i.e., fewer lawyers working on a deal). They are also often (from what I was told on vacation schemes) less hierarchical. They can be very dynamic as a result. They have fewer lawyers and are often less bureaucratic, so they can move more quickly than their larger UK peers.

These characteristics give rise to a number of positives and negatives, the importance of which will depend on you. For example, working in lean teams is likely to give you exposure to advanced work that you may not be able to experience until later in your career (potentially after qualification) at a UK firm. You may also have the opportunity to work alongside partners which will push you. Yet having smaller teams ultimately results in fewer people being able to shoulder the work. The promise of having greater responsibility from an early stage in your career is therefore a double-edged sword. Another distinctive characteristic is that US firms tend to employ a "learn on the job" model for trainee development. In contrast, UK firms tend to provide a more structured programme.

The above is non-exhaustive, but it should give you an idea of the sorts of thing that you should be thinking about. I would really encourage you to reflect on how you learn and work. Do you like working in big teams/with people, or do you prefer to work with fewer people? Do you like to learn as you do things?

One thing that is important to mention: when I was making the decision between firms (UK and US), I was told by a very senior partner at a US firm to ignore, as best I could, the pay difference on offer after qualification (and even as a trainee) at UK and US firms. They told me that the important thing was that I started my career at a place that would nourish my development and provide me with strong foundations from which to launch my career. The money will come if you lay strong foundations(!).

Following my vacation scheme experience at two US firms, the things that attracted me were: the agility of the teams, the ability to shape/accelerate my career if I wanted to, learning on the job and the people. I also liked the visibility of the senior leadership and their willingness to speak with trainees/vacation schemers. So if I were to answer this question, this is what I would focus on. That being said, I experienced aspects of these characteristics at HSF too, so you should treat these things as black and white.

Ultimately it is a bit of a simplistic question, but I hope that this might clarify how you might approach it! I am very happy to comment on your ideas if you have any or help otherwise if you would like!
 

letmeintolaw

Distinguished Member
Nov 11, 2021
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Hi @letmeintolaw,

Thank you for the question! I am delighted to help. Always feel free to follow up if anything is unclear.

So before you embark on your answer, consider the following:
  • The firm. US firms in London are not an homogenous group. For example, White & Case has 89 trainees in total, whereas Orrick has only 14 (and firms like Akin Gump has 13) (all according to Chambers Student). This is important because the size of trainee cohort will impact your experience as a junior lawyer. Generally speaking though, US firms have fewer trainees than UK firms. US firms in London also specialise in different things, although of course they will have multiple strengths. White & Case is very strong in EIPAF (Energy, Infrastructure, Project and Asset Finance) whereas Akin is known for financial restructuring/insolvency work.
  • Your priorities. What sort of work do you want to do? How do you work? What sort of career would you like to pursue? What sort of training would you like?
Generally speaking, US firms employ leaner teams (i.e., fewer lawyers working on a deal). They are also often (from what I was told on vacation schemes) less hierarchical. They can be very dynamic as a result. They have fewer lawyers and are often less bureaucratic, so they can move more quickly than their larger UK peers.

These characteristics give rise to a number of positives and negatives, the importance of which depend on you. For example, working in lean teams is likely to give you exposure to advanced work that you may not be able to experience until later in your career (potentially after qualification) at a UK firm. You may also have the opportunity to work alongside partners which will push you. Yet having smaller teams ultimately results in fewer people being able to shoulder the work. The promise of having greater responsibility from an early stage in your career is therefore a double-edged sword. Another distinctive characteristic is that US firms tend to employ a "learn on the job" model for trainee development. In contrast, UK firms tend to provide a more structured programme.

The above is non-exhaustive, but it should give you an idea of the sorts of thing that you should be thinking about. I would really encourage you to reflect on how you learn and work. Do you like working in big teams/with people, or do you prefer to work with fewer people? Do you like to learn as you do things?

One thing that is important to mention: when I was making the decision between firms (UK and US), I was told by a very senior partner at a US firm to ignore, as best I could, the pay difference on offer after qualification (and even as a trainee) at UK and US firms. They told me that the important thing was that I started my career at a place that would nourish my development and provide me with strong foundations from which to launch my career. The money will come if you lay strong foundations(!).

Following my vacation scheme experience at two US firms, the things that attracted me were: the agility of the teams, the ability to shape/accelerate my career if I wanted to, learning on the job and the people. I also liked the visibility of the senior leadership and their willingness to speak with trainees/vacation schemers. So if I were to answer this question, this is what I would focus on. That being said, I experienced aspects of these characteristics at HSF too, so you should treat these things as black and white.

Ultimately it is a bit of a simplistic question, but I hope that this might clarify how you might approach it! I am very happy to comment on your ideas if you have any or help otherwise if you would like!
This is amazing! SO helpful, thank you very much
 
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lawcurious

Distinguished Member
Nov 23, 2021
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This doc is definitely not law-focused/tailored to law firm interviews but I read it and found it useful for understanding interviews/why certain qs are asked in interviews better, and I do think the general advice given here is decent. I found it on someone's post on LinkedIn earlier and I thought I'd share it in case it helps anybody else as well: https://media-exp1.licdn.com/dms/do...t=YMt-UZmd7wOdGmD7uZqCWsFwjlJZGrvymA4wW-Hy77g
 

Ameliaa

Legendary Member
Premium Member
Jan 4, 2022
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Hi I've realised I made a terrible error on one of my training contract application forms 🥲. Instead of putting I did my degree at UCL I had written that it was done at UAL.

The deadline for the application was on the 3rd of June. I had submitted it before the deadline but only noticed it today when I was scanning through the form. Should I email graduate recruitment the correction and just wait for my rejection?
 

George Maxwell

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Premium Member
Junior Lawyer 50
Oct 25, 2021
552
1,084
Hi I've realised I made a terrible error on one of my training contract application forms 🥲. Instead of putting I did my degree at UCL I had written that it was done at UAL.

The deadline for the application was on the 3rd of June. I had submitted it before the deadline but only noticed it today when I was scanning through the form. Should I email graduate recruitment the correction and just wait for my rejection?
Hey @Ameliaa,

My advice would be to email graduate recruitment informing them of the mistake. Ask if it is possible for them to make the alteration. For what it is worth, I highly doubt that this will equate to an automatic rejection!

I empathise with you though as I know how stressful finding mistakes in submitted applications can be. I am sorry that you find yourself in this position too. Remember you can only do your best and try not to be too hard on yourself.

I actually sent an email asking to correct a mistake on a submitted application when I was applying. I received an email back from the Graduate Recruitment team telling me that they would make the change and not to worry!

Let me know what you end up doing and how it goes 🚀
 
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Ameliaa

Legendary Member
Premium Member
Jan 4, 2022
151
260
Hey @Ameliaa,

My advice would be to email graduate recruitment informing them of the mistake. Ask if it is possible for them to make the alteration. For what it is worth, I highly doubt that this will equate to an automatic rejection!

I empathise with you though as I know how stressful finding mistakes in submitted applications can be. I am sorry that you find yourself in this position too. Remember you can only do your best and try not to be too hard on yourself.

I actually sent an email asking to correct a mistake on a submitted application when I was applying. I received an email back from the Graduate Recruitment team telling me that they would make the change and not to worry!

Let me know what you end up doing and how it goes 🚀
Thank you so much for the advice and sharing your experience @George Maxwell!

I have emailed Graduate Recruitment informing them of the mistake and asked them if it would be possible to make the alteration :)
 
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ofm

Distinguished Member
  • Jan 14, 2021
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    Been asked to complete a conflicts form for a VS but needs to go back three years... I can't remember the matters I worked on before 2 years ago - is this a massive problem? Thinking of submitting only including everything I can remember!
     

    Jessica Booker

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    Aug 1, 2019
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    Been asked to complete a conflicts form for a VS but needs to go back three years... I can't remember the matters I worked on before 2 years ago - is this a massive problem? Thinking of submitting only including everything I can remember!
    If you do, you’ll need to make it clear that this is only what you remember working on and that other matters are missing.
     
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