TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2024-25

[InterestInPublicLaw]

I applied for the Vac Scheme!

thank you!

 

[trainee4u]

all these months of applying and I only just clocked that it's called a TC in part because of the actual contact that's signed between you and the firm.... 🤦‍♀️

there's a longer history

Attorneys and Solicitors Act 1728

After 1 Decem. 1730. none to act as an Attorney unless he has served a Clerkship, and been admitted.

That from and after the first Day of December one thousand seven hundred and thirty, no Person, who shall not before the said first Day of December have been sworn, admitted and inrolled, pursuant to the Directions of this Act, shall be permitted to Act as an Attorney, or to sue out any Writ or Process, or to commence, carry on or defend any Action or Actions, or any Proceedings, either before or after Judgement obtained, in the Name or Names of any other Person or Persons in any of the Courts of Law aforesaid, unless such Person shall have been bound, by Contract in Writing, to serve as a Clerk for and during the Space of five Years, to an Attorney duly and legally sworn and admitted, as herein before is directed, in some or one of the Courts herein before mentioned; and that such Person, for and during the said Term of five Years, shall have continued in such Service, and also unless such Person, after the Expiration of the said Term of five Years, shall be examined, sworn, admitted and inrolled, in the same Manner as the Persons, who shall be admitted Attornies of the said Courts, are herein before required to be examine, sworn, admitted and inrolled.

I looked one up:

Father paid £200 in 1801 (~£13k), inclusive of food and board, but not clothes to Augustus Hamet, a solicitor.
His son was to serve for six years (unpaid) as an articled clerk to Hamet, then become admitted as a solicitor
Son is to be instructed in law by Hamet, and not be transferred/sold to other parties.
If Hamet died before six years, his estate was required to repay proportion of the £200.

The agreement was indented, which meant cut into two halfs in serrated pattern, to be kept by the two parties to guard against forgery, this is more generally called an "indenture of apprenticeship" (an articled clerk was simply a specific form of apprentice, although it was usual to refer to "articles of clerkship" for solicitors & notaries, and indentures of apprenticeships more generally).

The 'articles' referred to in the term "articled clerk" are the terms of the contract, and it was thus sometimes referred to as a "contract of clerkship".

The articles/contract were eventually regulated by the Law Society under the various Solicitors Acts. In the 1990 Training Regulations made under s 2 of the Solicitors Act 1974, the Law Society changed the name from 'Articles' to 'Training Contract'

Under the SRA's old training regulations, solicitors qualified under a TC.

These regulations no longer apply, except for LPC candidates, and going forward it's all QWE.

Unlike LPC, there is no requirement for training, and it's instead a matter of certifying that you have developed the relevant competences: https://www.sra.org.uk/solicitors/standards-regulations/authorisation-individuals-regulations/#reg-2

This can be done by working as a paralegal.

A training contract is specifically a contract of apprenticeship, i.e. an apprenticeship at common law, as in centuries gone by.

You can also become a solicitor under a six year apprenticeship agreement as an approved English apprenticeship under the Apprenticeships, Skills, Children and Learning Act 2009.

An approved English apprenticeship can be terminated early. However, a common law apprenticeship remains governed by centuries-old law. An apprenticeship contract is for the purpose of training, and if the employer breaches it by terminating it before the two years is up, they are liable to pay damages both for the remainder of the contract, AND for future employment prospects. https://www.irwinmitchell.com/news-...enticeship-contracts-six-traps-for-the-unwary.

Therefore the training contract is both a contract for training and hence a common-law apprenticeship, and a contract of employment, whereas a paralegal would work under a contract of employment only. Firms can take advantage of this flexibility (at the expense of trainees) by training paralegals without giving them a training contract and avoiding the common law apprenticeship liabilities. Even though the SRA no longer regulate TCs (except for legacy LPC candidates), they still provide not only greater prestige for future solicitors than QWE other-than-through-a-TC, but also virtually cast iron certainty to qualify as a solicitor from the date of signature.

 

[LillyandSilver]

The agreement was indented, which meant cut into two halfs in serrated pattern, to be kept by the two parties to guard against forgery, this is more generally called an "indenture of apprenticeship" (an articled clerk was simply a specific form of apprentice, although it was usual to refer to "articles of clerkship" for solicitors & notaries, and indentures of apprenticeships more generally).

The 'articles' referred to in the term "articled clerk" are the terms of the contract, and it was thus sometimes referred to as a "contract of clerkship".

The articles/contract were eventually regulated by the Law Society under the various Solicitors Acts. In the 1990 Training Regulations made under s 2 of the Solicitors Act 1974, the Law Society changed the name from 'Articles' to 'Training Contract'

OMG this is why my parents friends always ask me when i'm doing my articles!!!

 

[trainee4u]

OMG this is why my parents friends always ask me when i'm doing my articles!!!

yes it's quite a long time ago that it changed.
the term "articles" was subsequently removed from the Solicitors Act as an incidental amendment in the Legal Services Act 2007, 17 years after the Law Society changed from "articles" to "training contract".

 

[badmintonflyinginsect]

I was unable to convert my VS into a TC this cycle. How should I approach mentioning/speaking about this in applications + interviews (if at all)?

 

[trainee4u]

I was unable to convert my VS into a TC this cycle. How should I approach mentioning/speaking about this in applications + interviews (if at all)?

specifically I'd highlight the positives of getting the the VS and what you learned from it and not mention the implied that you didnt convert.

however, if you were to mention it you'd probably focus on what you learned and highlight that you are adaptable or perhaps focus on the parts that you didn't do well on.

e.g., "following unsuccessful interview for TC post-VS, I proactively [don't say this if you were sent it] sought feedback, and it was highlighted that other candidates had more extensive legal work experience."

so here you give a reason that's "not your fault" (obviously if they said 'they didn't like my personality and had little legal work experience' you'd ignore the 'bad personality' feedback and go with a truthful but partial answer)

and explain why this is mistaken

"I learn quickly and am confident that I can thrive as a trainee from day one."

but also can highlight what you're doing to address that

"however I am working at the CAB providing legal advice/doing work experience at my local solicitors' firm to increase my legal work experience. "

Essentially show that why you were not taken on is something that's fixable AND how you are fixing it.

For example if my work comes across well on paper but poorly in interview I'd say that and explain how I'm spending several hours a day practising and am seeing results from endeavours.

 

[billyonthespeeddial]

Any post-interview news from Winston yet?

 

[kleinbottle]

Hi, I'm new here so I'm not sure where to post this! I have a friend who completed the Milbank Spring Scheme, and she mentioned that a few training contracts have already been offered. For context, I think they give 8 general TCs and 4 LevFin track ones. I'm due to do the Summer Vacation Scheme for the LevFin track, and she told me there are only two LevFin TCs left — and that's before the summer cohort even starts. How do I stay positive when it feels like I'm working towards such a small chance? And is there a chance I'd be offered a general TC if I was good enough, even if I just sit in LevFin during my scheme?

 

[tryingtogetajob555]

has anyone heard back from Devonshires after their interview?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Hi, I'm new here so I'm not sure where to post this! I have a friend who completed the Milbank Spring Scheme, and she mentioned that a few training contracts have already been offered. For context, I think they give 8 general TCs and 4 LevFin track ones. I'm due to do the Summer Vacation Scheme for the LevFin track, and she told me there are only two LevFin TCs left — and that's before the summer cohort even starts. How do I stay positive when it feels like I'm working towards such a small chance? And is there a chance I'd be offered a general TC if I was good enough, even if I just sit in LevFin during my scheme?

I'd stress that the number of offers made do not mean the number of places taken. People turn down offers even for high profile firms like Milbank.

Firms can also offer later intakes if they do have a very strong cohort of vacation scheme students.

 

[Someoneinlaw]

Does anyone that has received interview invite know how book interview for Moore Barlow please? We were sent a spread sheet where all the available interview dates are , do we put our names in front of our choices or reply Grad rec with our preferred dates?

 

[JonjoShelvey]

Been offered a Linklaters training contract following a vacation scheme! Thanks all for the support on this forum

 

[Jessica Booker]

Standing Been offered a Linklaters training contract following a vacation scheme! Thanks all for the support on this forum

That’s fantastic news! Congratulations

 

[Ruth A]

does anyone have insights on faegre drinker pleasee xx

 

[eguizot]

Did anyone get a VI from Fox Williams? How was it?

Have you heard back yet? I have not heard anything

 

[theruleofno]

Hi, I'm new here so I'm not sure where to post this! I have a friend who completed the Milbank Spring Scheme, and she mentioned that a few training contracts have already been offered. For context, I think they give 8 general TCs and 4 LevFin track ones. I'm due to do the Summer Vacation Scheme for the LevFin track, and she told me there are only two LevFin TCs left — and that's before the summer cohort even starts. How do I stay positive when it feels like I'm working towards such a small chance? And is there a chance I'd be offered a general TC if I was good enough, even if I just sit in LevFin during my scheme?

Ur cooked doing the LevFin route. I know someone on that Vac Scheme and they were in until like past midnight almost every day

 

[Andrei Radu]

Hi, I'm new here so I'm not sure where to post this! I have a friend who completed the Milbank Spring Scheme, and she mentioned that a few training contracts have already been offered. For context, I think they give 8 general TCs and 4 LevFin track ones. I'm due to do the Summer Vacation Scheme for the LevFin track, and she told me there are only two LevFin TCs left — and that's before the summer cohort even starts. How do I stay positive when it feels like I'm working towards such a small chance? And is there a chance I'd be offered a general TC if I was good enough, even if I just sit in LevFin during my scheme?

Having done the normal Milbank VS last year, I can tell you @Jessica Booker is definitely right in that the firm will likely end up making more offers than they have TC places available. Some candidates will be doing other VSs so sometimes end up choosing other firms, while others completely move away from the commercial law route. Thus, I think based on the numbers in my cohort the offer rate was closer to the 35-40% mark. Thus, even on paper, your chances may not be as low as you think.

Beyond that, you need to keep in mind that it is the partners who are the ultimate decision makers for hiring decisions. It is not as uncommon as you may think for firms generally, and also Milbank in particular, to end up hiring slightly above their stated target. If the firm is convinced that the talent pool in a given cohort is exceptionally high, and the partners really like you, they can make you an offer even if though in theory there were no more places available. You can never know that will be the case, but if that's gonna happen anywhere, Milbank is definitely a good shout. They have had an amazing year as a firm, growing their average PEP by an incredible 33% to reach a figure of $6.8 million. This puts them in the top 10 most profitable firms in the world, overtaking titans like Sullivan & Cromwell. They have also been growing their London base a lot in recent years, both in terms of general size and in regards to the trainee cohort - in my year it was a total of 6, a couple of years before that it was 4.

As for your question about changing from the LevFin track, while perhaps not impossible in theory I think it is very unlikely to happen in practice. The very reason this track was implemented this year was because levfin the team has been very busy and in constant need of trainees and NQ associates, a need which was not sufficiently serviced by hiring done via the normal manner. Milbank's problem was not getting enough people in levfin, not the other way around - so I doubt they would take action which might undermine the solution they have come up with.

Finally, as for general pieces of advice, I have two. Firstly, try to learn as much as you can about levfin work as you can before the TC. As other forum members have stated, the scheme will likely be very work intensive so your performance in that regard that will be the primary consideration in their decision-making. Secondly, the attitude I would advise you to have is to focus on what you can control. Everyone on the scheme will be in the same boat as you and fighting the same odds. There is no reason to presume you are more disadvantaged by them than the others are. Ultimately, of course, the TC decision does not rest with you. What you can control is whether or not you do your best to maximize those odds by preparing as well as you can and having a great attitude throughout the scheme. Going in with this mindset, of simply aiming to perform to the best standard I can hold myself to, was really helpful for me when in your position, as I knew that even if I would not get the offer, I would have nothing to reproach myself for.

 

[Andrei Radu]

I was unable to convert my VS into a TC this cycle. How should I approach mentioning/speaking about this in applications + interviews (if at all)?

I do not have much to add to the great advice from @trainee4u here. The one thing I would also say about interviews is that while you can mention the influence of factors beyond your control (eg how extensive your past work experience was), it is important to take ownership of the fact that you could have performed better in certain ways. Almost no candidate will have an absolutely flawless academic/professional background, and when firms ask about parts you may be less proud of, they aim to assess whether you are self-aware enough to accept your mistakes and to attempt to move past them or if you fall to the temptation of instantly deflecting negative feedback and blaming it on circumstance.

At the applications stage, I do not think there is any need for you to explain why you did not convert a VS. Just having it in your CV and mentioning it in connection to your motivation will be a significant boost to your candidate profile, as it will have show how far the track to a TC you went. The question as to why you did not go all the way is simply not so relevant at a stage where they just aim to filter out the candidates that will not make it to a second or third stage.

 

[JustwantaTC]

@Andrei Radu @Jessica Booker would a paralegal role in a high street firm be okay to take up after failing to get a TC for two cycles and after one vac scheme? Would this be a wise move in terms of motivations for the new cycle? I just don't want to be unemployed whilst applying so weighing up my options here. thank you for any advice you may have

 

[Jessica Booker]

@Andrei Radu @Jessica Booker would a paralegal role in a high street firm be okay to take up after failing to get a TC for two cycles and after one vac scheme? Would this be a wise move in terms of motivations for the new cycle? I just don't want to be unemployed whilst applying so weighing up my options here. thank you for any advice you may have

Yes - it is fine to take a non-commercial role up. Many people applying for training contracts are in non-legal and/or non-commercial roles. Focus on demonstrating the transferable skills and knowledge from your role and consider how you can demonstrate your pursuit of commercial law through other activities.