General Discussion Thread 2020-21

[TCLA Community Assistant]

Re WGT tests, does the time impact the percentile (assuming it's done within the time limit, say, 30m!)

sometimes - depends on how the firm choose to set it up.

 

[tcsearcher]

Received a vacation scheme offer from DAC Beachcroft yesterday, beyond excited!!!

 

[33c]

you should definitely contact them - 4-5 weeks is a very long time.

The exception is if they told you you wouldn’t hear back until after a certain date and that date hasn’t passed.

Thanks Jessica. Should I wait until Monday to contact them or is the weekend ok?

 

[TCLA Community Assistant]

Thanks Jessica. Should I wait until Monday to contact them or is the weekend ok?

call them on Monday. You aren’t going to get a response at the weekend anyway.

 

[madge]

Is it looked down upon by firms if you haven’t secured a Vacation Scheme even if you have lots of other law work experience (e.g. pro bono)? I read on a blog that people getting TCs with no Vacation Scheme is the exception not the rule, but I’ve also read that many people do secure TCs without having done a VS, so I’m a bit confused!

 

[TCLA Community Assistant]

Is it looked down upon by firms if you haven’t secured a Vacation Scheme even if you have lots of other law work experience (e.g. pro bono)? I read on a blog that people getting TCs with no Vacation Scheme is the exception not the rule, but I’ve also read that many people do secure TCs without having done a VS, so I’m a bit confused!

A VS isn’t everything - but other work experience is. I can’t remember recruiting someone who never had a job.

you can have other work experience, probably supplemented by insight days/virtual events etc and a a very clear understanding of why you want to do the job (the good, bad and indifferent of that job) and write that well on an application form and get a TC.

 

[theTC_girl]

Hello, anyone heard back from Harbottle & Lewis or done the first stage interview yet?

 

[S87]

Hello, anyone heard back from Harbottle & Lewis or done the first stage interview yet?

I am still waiting to hear back

 

[RS Sinatra]

Hello! has anyone heard from white & case for the direct TC application?

 

[Adam Gilchrist]

Is it looked down upon by firms if you haven’t secured a Vacation Scheme even if you have lots of other law work experience (e.g. pro bono)? I read on a blog that people getting TCs with no Vacation Scheme is the exception not the rule, but I’ve also read that many people do secure TCs without having done a VS, so I’m a bit confused!

It is possible, but very, very difficult, and I'd definitely query the "many" bit of what you've read. The point is that naturally commercial law isn't everyone's cup of tea - the subject matter, the hours and so on dissuade a lot of people. On top of that, a lot of people really don't understand exactly what a commercial lawyer does when they first think of applying.

From a firm's point of view, it's much better that if they make you a TC offer - a costly and time-consuming process, - you already have evidence that you already have some semblance of an idea of what the work/life of a corporate lawyer is, so you are less likely to drop out or cause havoc by falling behind on work, will require less unnecessary handholding, and so on. Having a VS at a commercial law firm shows that at least in part you can handle this life and have an understanding of what goes on/what is expected of you.

I know two people who managed to get a TC without a VS first: one had done a stack of mini-pupillages at some of the top commercial barristers' chambers, the other had interned at the ICC. It's not impossible, but it really isn't very common either.

The other point of the "many people" is exactly where they got offered a TC. This isn't meant in a snobbish sense, just that some smaller and less elaborate firms might be more willing to do this than a Moneylaw/MC/SC/WS firm, which was probably what the blog (and most people on this forum/legalcheek commenters etc) are thinking of.

Lastly, it's worth remembering that quite a few firms exclusively recruit from their vac schemes (Davis Polk, Jones Day, HSF, Ropes & Gray, Shearman & Sterling, etc); theoretically recruit from outside their VS but don't in reality (Skadden, Kirkland & Ellis); or give the overwhelming majority of their offers to vac schemers (Linklaters & the rest of the MC), so your odds of getting a TC by direct application range from comparatively slim to zilch.

 

[nymi]

Hello! has anyone heard from white & case for the direct TC application?

still waiting !

 

[Las123]

Is it looked down upon by firms if you haven’t secured a Vacation Scheme even if you have lots of other law work experience (e.g. pro bono)? I read on a blog that people getting TCs with no Vacation Scheme is the exception not the rule, but I’ve also read that many people do secure TCs without having done a VS, so I’m a bit confused!

Hi Madge,

I secured a TC at a Magic Circle firm without having done a VS, and I too was worried that maybe not having a VS would put me at a disadvantage. But this is absolutely not the case if you’re able to show that you really understand the day-to-day job of a commercial lawyer, and have relevant experience where you’ve demonstrated the qualities required.
One tip I would give is to really get a good understanding of what it is about your experiences that has motivated you towards pursuing a career as a commercial solicitor, and picking out examples of work-experience you’ve done to support your motivations. Construct your experiences into a well-reasoned story line, and when you’re really clear about your reasons for the profession, it comes across to the reviewer/interviewer too.

If you’re sure about working at the firm you’re applying to and feel that a direct TC app is the best choice for you, I would not be put off of applying for a direct TC.
Good luck going forward!

 

[JKs]

Has anyone looked at the TC application questions for A&O? The form is so annoying as you can't look at the different sections and you have to complete everything from the start (there's also no back button so I can't click through to see the questions and then click back to the start of the form). I want to see the questions first and copy them into a word document without having to waste time populating everything else and then it turns out that I hate the questions and the questions have put me off from applying!

 

[D]

Has anyone looked at the TC application questions for A&O? The form is so annoying as you can't look at the different sections and you have to complete everything from the start (there's also no back button so I can't click through to see the questions and then click back to the start of the form). I want to see the questions first and copy them into a word document without having to waste time populating everything else and then it turns out that I hate the questions and the questions have put me off from applying!

From my recollection, you can edit at the end? Just go through, type "x" in the box and copy the question down each time. Or - just make a new login to do so if you are worried.

I do remember the platform being quite obnoxious last year. There's a few firms that use different platforms, when we are all begging for the ease of apply4law

 

[TCLA Community Assistant]

From my recollection, you can edit at the end? Just go through, type "x" in the box and copy the question down each time. Or - just make a new login to do so if you are worried.

I do remember the platform being quite obnoxious last year. There's a few firms that use different platforms, when we are all begging for the ease of apply4law

trust me, the recruiters are begging for apply4law too, but the decision isn’t typically with them

 

[Nat000]

Has anyone looked at the TC application questions for A&O? The form is so annoying as you can't look at the different sections and you have to complete everything from the start (there's also no back button so I can't click through to see the questions and then click back to the start of the form). I want to see the questions first and copy them into a word document without having to waste time populating everything else and then it turns out that I hate the questions and the questions have put me off from applying!

I just wrote random letters in the text boxes so it would let me progress to the next stage, then edited in my answers at the 'review application' stage which is 99% in!

 

[Law123]

@Jessica Booker

In a virtual vacation scheme, what kind of questions could be asked to the recruiters to impress and show knowledge on the firm? Thank you!

 

[TCLA Community Assistant]

@Jessica Booker

In a virtual vacation scheme, what kind of questions could be asked to the recruiters to impress and show knowledge on the firm? Thank you!

My advice is to not take this approach.

Trying to impress recruiters isn’t really the way to go - they’ll see through it.

You don’t have to demonstrate your knowledge of the firm to recruiters on a virtual vacation scheme. You did that when you secured the vacation scheme in the first place.

If you want to ask questions, make sure they are genuine questions, appropriate to the audience, that you haven’t been able to find the answer to of your own accord.

 

[Law123]

Thank you! @Jessica Booker

 

[33c]

Anyone heard back from Freshfields post-WG?