TCLA Vacation Scheme Applications Discussion Thread 2021-22 (#1)

[Bianka]

Has anyone heard back from Arnold & Porter post interview?

 

[LegalStudent556]

Hi everyone,
i have recently had a succcessful application to attend weightmans vacation scheme and assessment centre. Does anyone have any ideas as to what sort of tasks could come for the assessment centre or any general knowledge of the firm which could help me?

 

[FutureLawyer99]

Hey @letmeintolaw,

This is awesome news congratulations! Do let me know if you would like any advice ahead of your interview. I never interviewed with Orrick, but have plenty of interviewing experience with US firms.

Fingers are crossed for you🤞

Hey @davina99,

I think I would follow Jess's approach on this. I would interpret this question as asking primarily about work done by the firm on behalf of a client in one of their specialist sectors.

A suggested structure for this question might be:

1. Identify and (briefly) describe the deal/work. In one sentence describe why you have picked it/it stood out to you.
2. Contextualise the work (i.e., has the sector more broadly been significantly impacted by inflation/supply chain issues?) (Briefly) explain why this work is important.
3. Unpack the reason(s) why this particularly interested you and link back to yourself where appropriate.
4. Link back to wider themes and your ambitions as a future trainee (if not already covered in 3).

How are you thinking about structuring your answer so far?

Hey @Amanpreet,

Great question and congratulations for your paralegal role! I know how competitive these are, so well done!

I think it would be appropriate to write something like "Incoming X Paralegal at Dentons" in your work experience section (replacing X with the relevant practice area you are starting with).

Others may disagree though and this is, to some extent, personal preference!

Let me know if I can help with anything else

Hey @WiseOwl,

Again this is a fantastic question. From my experience (I did three exit interviews), I would do the following:

1. Ask graduate recruitment/other future trainees at the firm/previous vacation schemers what the interview is likely to consist of.

2. Reflect on your vacation scheme. I would really encourage you to think about what the scheme taught you going forward and what you would do differently if you were to do the scheme again. For example, what work did you do? What did you enjoy most? What did you least enjoy? How did you develop during your scheme? What did you learn? Biggest mistake? How were you proactive? Why did you standout?

3. Treat it like a normal interview. For example, make sure that you have been keeping an eye on recent commercial events (even during the scheme). Think how this might impact the firm, which practice areas would likely be engaged. Use a SWOT analysis.

The above will depend on 1. to some extent, but broadly speaking in my experience, I was always glad to have prepared thoroughly (even if some of my preparation wasn't directly relevant to the interview in the end).

I found exit interviews were largely about the partners learning about my motivations, my ability to reflect on the experience, in addition to my willingness to develop and improve for next time. Often they were described as 'chats', although I always found that they tested me like a normal interview. I did not find my exit interviews as stressful as general application interviews though. They generally were less than an hour, and felt more relaxed (although I would be wary about being too casual, as ultimately they will form part of your assessment!).

I hope that helps! I am very happy to answer any follow-up questions that you might have 🚀

Hi George, so I have pretty much structured the TLT answer in this manner but also included a section on how TLT impacted this deal and why it would interest me in being a TLT trainee

 

[George Maxwell]

Hi George, so I have pretty much structured the TLT answer in this manner but also included a section on how TLT impacted this deal and why it would interest me in being a TLT trainee

Hey @davina99,

This sounds very sensible. Do let me know when you hear! Fingers crossed for you 🚀

 

[letmeintolaw]

Hey @letmeintolaw,

This is awesome news congratulations! Do let me know if you would like any advice ahead of your interview. I never interviewed with Orrick, but have plenty of interviewing experience with US firms.

Fingers are crossed for you🤞

Hi George thank you for the offer! Are you able to say how you would approach the general question of being asked 'why do you want to work for a US firm'?

 

[refy]

Assuming that W&C have stopped giving out AC invites? 🥲 🥲

 

[George Maxwell]

Hi George thank you for the offer! Are you able to say how you would approach the general question of being asked 'why do you want to work for a US firm'?

Hi @letmeintolaw,

Thank you for the question! I am delighted to help. Always feel free to follow up if anything is unclear.

So before you embark on your answer, consider the following:

• The firm. US firms in London are not an homogenous group. For example, White & Case has 89 trainees in total, whereas Orrick has only 14 (and firms like Akin Gump has 13) (all according to Chambers Student). This is important because the size of trainee cohort will impact your experience as a junior lawyer. Generally speaking though, US firms have fewer trainees than UK firms. US firms in London also specialise in different things, although of course they will have multiple strengths. White & Case is very strong in EIPAF (Energy, Infrastructure, Project and Asset Finance) whereas Akin is known for financial restructuring/insolvency work.
• Your priorities. What sort of work do you want to do? How do you work? What sort of career would you like to pursue? What sort of training would you like?

Generally speaking, US firms employ leaner teams (i.e., fewer lawyers working on a deal). They are also often (from what I was told on vacation schemes) less hierarchical. They can be very dynamic as a result. They have fewer lawyers and are often less bureaucratic, so they can move more quickly than their larger UK peers.

These characteristics give rise to a number of positives and negatives, the importance of which will depend on you. For example, working in lean teams is likely to give you exposure to advanced work that you may not be able to experience until later in your career (potentially after qualification) at a UK firm. You may also have the opportunity to work alongside partners which will push you. Yet having smaller teams ultimately results in fewer people being able to shoulder the work. The promise of having greater responsibility from an early stage in your career is therefore a double-edged sword. Another distinctive characteristic is that US firms tend to employ a "learn on the job" model for trainee development. In contrast, UK firms tend to provide a more structured programme.

The above is non-exhaustive, but it should give you an idea of the sorts of thing that you should be thinking about. I would really encourage you to reflect on how you learn and work. Do you like working in big teams/with people, or do you prefer to work with fewer people? Do you like to learn as you do things?

One thing that is important to mention: when I was making the decision between firms (UK and US), I was told by a very senior partner at a US firm to ignore, as best I could, the pay difference on offer after qualification (and even as a trainee) at UK and US firms. They told me that the important thing was that I started my career at a place that would nourish my development and provide me with strong foundations from which to launch my career. The money will come if you lay strong foundations(!).

Following my vacation scheme experience at two US firms, the things that attracted me were: the agility of the teams, the ability to shape/accelerate my career if I wanted to, learning on the job and the people. I also liked the visibility of the senior leadership and their willingness to speak with trainees/vacation schemers. So if I were to answer this question, this is what I would focus on. That being said, I experienced aspects of these characteristics at HSF too, so you should treat these things as black and white.

Ultimately it is a bit of a simplistic question, but I hope that this might clarify how you might approach it! I am very happy to comment on your ideas if you have any or help otherwise if you would like!

 

[letmeintolaw]

Hi @letmeintolaw,

Thank you for the question! I am delighted to help. Always feel free to follow up if anything is unclear.

So before you embark on your answer, consider the following:

• The firm. US firms in London are not an homogenous group. For example, White & Case has 89 trainees in total, whereas Orrick has only 14 (and firms like Akin Gump has 13) (all according to Chambers Student). This is important because the size of trainee cohort will impact your experience as a junior lawyer. Generally speaking though, US firms have fewer trainees than UK firms. US firms in London also specialise in different things, although of course they will have multiple strengths. White & Case is very strong in EIPAF (Energy, Infrastructure, Project and Asset Finance) whereas Akin is known for financial restructuring/insolvency work.
• Your priorities. What sort of work do you want to do? How do you work? What sort of career would you like to pursue? What sort of training would you like?

Generally speaking, US firms employ leaner teams (i.e., fewer lawyers working on a deal). They are also often (from what I was told on vacation schemes) less hierarchical. They can be very dynamic as a result. They have fewer lawyers and are often less bureaucratic, so they can move more quickly than their larger UK peers.

These characteristics give rise to a number of positives and negatives, the importance of which depend on you. For example, working in lean teams is likely to give you exposure to advanced work that you may not be able to experience until later in your career (potentially after qualification) at a UK firm. You may also have the opportunity to work alongside partners which will push you. Yet having smaller teams ultimately results in fewer people being able to shoulder the work. The promise of having greater responsibility from an early stage in your career is therefore a double-edged sword. Another distinctive characteristic is that US firms tend to employ a "learn on the job" model for trainee development. In contrast, UK firms tend to provide a more structured programme.

The above is non-exhaustive, but it should give you an idea of the sorts of thing that you should be thinking about. I would really encourage you to reflect on how you learn and work. Do you like working in big teams/with people, or do you prefer to work with fewer people? Do you like to learn as you do things?

One thing that is important to mention: when I was making the decision between firms (UK and US), I was told by a very senior partner at a US firm to ignore, as best I could, the pay difference on offer after qualification (and even as a trainee) at UK and US firms. They told me that the important thing was that I started my career at a place that would nourish my development and provide me with strong foundations from which to launch my career. The money will come if you lay strong foundations(!).

Following my vacation scheme experience at two US firms, the things that attracted me were: the agility of the teams, the ability to shape/accelerate my career if I wanted to, learning on the job and the people. I also liked the visibility of the senior leadership and their willingness to speak with trainees/vacation schemers. So if I were to answer this question, this is what I would focus on. That being said, I experienced aspects of these characteristics at HSF too, so you should treat these things as black and white.

Ultimately it is a bit of a simplistic question, but I hope that this might clarify how you might approach it! I am very happy to comment on your ideas if you have any or help otherwise if you would like!

This is amazing! SO helpful, thank you very much

 

[George Maxwell]

@letmeintolaw I also just came across this and this post. Although they are answering a slightly different question, they might prompt some ideas for you!

 

[George Maxwell]

This is amazing! SO helpful, thank you very much

You are so welcome! Always here to answer any follow-ups

 

[LS_1998]

Has anyone heard back from DACB post video interview? I think they said June for AC invites but I'm just wondering if anyone has prematurely found out anything!

 

[Legalmel_99]

It will be 2nd week of June at the latest

 

[GXA123]

Do we use our laptops on the vs?

 

[Jessica Booker]

Do we use our laptops on the vs?

It is unlikely due to all the IT security aspects. However, if it’s a virtual scheme with no work (just simulations and meetings) then that could be the case.

 

[TC fiend]

Do we use our laptops on the vs?

If this is in person then I’d assume no - they should provide you with laptops so you can access the secure server and use their software.

 

[GXA123]

If this is in person then I’d assume no - they should provide you with laptops so you can access the secure server and use their software.

I am assuming we will get specific emails as well?

 

[justanotherlawstudent]

If a firm which mainly takes applicants from their vacation scheme opens their direct TC applications then does this mean they have spaces left or is that just their normal protocol?

 

[Jessica Booker]

I am assuming we will get specific emails as well?

Yes, if you are sitting with a department you will have access to their systems and an email address

 

[Legal Chick]

Has anyone heard from Clyde for the 22 Tc application

 

[lawcurious]

This doc is definitely not law-focused/tailored to law firm interviews but I read it and found it useful for understanding interviews/why certain qs are asked in interviews better, and I do think the general advice given here is decent. I found it on someone's post on LinkedIn earlier and I thought I'd share it in case it helps anybody else as well: https://media-exp1.licdn.com/dms/do...t=YMt-UZmd7wOdGmD7uZqCWsFwjlJZGrvymA4wW-Hy77g